Rear wheel came off after bearing replacement

J6TM1 · 06-01-2020 03:52PM #1

Car: VW Golf Mark 3

I had a recent NCT fail with both rear wheel bearings worn and requiring tightening / replacement.

Put them into a local garage for replacement.

About a week later after a 1 hour motorway journey at 120kph, I noticed some weird sounds coming from passenger-side rear wheel.
Slowed right down immediately. As I was only 2km from the destination, I went at low speed to babysit it to the destination. However, much to my surprise, following a loud bang and the rear of the car dropping down, the wheel came off and rolled about 100m across a field.

The retaining nut on the hub was so tight that it would not loosen with a spanner with someone standing on it.
It took a hammer and much brute force to get it off.

One suspicion was that the nut was overtightened when refitting and this may have could the hot / expanded bearing to fail due to no play...

Any thoughts on why this may have happened would be appreciated...?

Whocare · 06-01-2020 04:17PM

What did the garage say

swarlb · 06-01-2020 04:43PM

J6TM1 wrote: »

Car: VW Golf Mark 3

I had a recent NCT fail with both rear wheel bearings worn and requiring tightening / replacement.

Put them into a local garage for replacement.

About a week later after a 1 hour motorway journey at 120kph, I noticed some weird sounds coming from passenger-side rear wheel.
Slowed right down immediately. As I was only 2km from the destination, I went at low speed to babysit it to the destination. However, much to my surprise, following a loud bang and the rear of the car dropping down, the wheel came off and rolled about 100m across a field.

The retaining nut on the hub was so tight that it would not loosen with a spanner with someone standing on it.
It took a hammer and much brute force to get it off.

One suspicion was that the nut was overtightened when refitting and this may have could the hot / expanded bearing to fail due to no play...

Any thoughts on why this may have happened would be appreciated...?

So... what you are saying is... the retaining nut remained in place, but the bearing came off ?

That's like saying you were walking along the road, when suddenly your sock flew off, but your shoes stayed put, and the laces were so tangled they needed to be cut off with a very sharp knife......

Isambard · 06-01-2020 04:47PM

well some cars have (or had) the rear wheels retained only by the bearing being pressed on so it's not impossible.

Welcome to Boards by the way, I see you just joined.

mickuhaha · 06-01-2020 04:55PM

Do you have a picture. The axle nut holds the bearing and everything except the wheel on. Did the axle come off too.

J6TM1 · 06-01-2020 05:08PM

The nut remained in place along with the stub axle believe it or not...

I am a new user so subject to a 24hr rule for posting links - I'll try tomorrow for the photos.

tabby aspreme · 06-01-2020 05:12PM

Is there drum or disc brakes on the rear of the car

mickuhaha · 06-01-2020 05:16PM

It could be that the bearing was never greased. I drove a van with a heavy load one evening and it took about 40 miles for the bearing to collapse. No I didn't know the bearing was on the way out. The van gave a warning wobble while driving that warned me to pull over. Got out and wheel was about 4 cm further out at the top.

J6TM1 · 07-01-2020 07:29AM

Whocare wrote: »

What did the garage say

The garage will cover everything, so there are no issues on that front. Not much discussion about details other than that... so was looking to understand the mechanism of how this could happen...

J6TM1 · 07-01-2020 07:31AM

swarlb wrote: »

So... what you are saying is... the retaining nut remained in place, but the bearing came off ?

That's like saying you were walking along the road, when suddenly your sock flew off, but your shoes stayed put, and the laces were so tangles they needed to be cut off with a very sharp knife......

Thanks swarlb
Your colourful use of imagery had me laughing out loud for a good while

J6TM1 · 07-01-2020 07:34AM

Isambard wrote: »

well some cars have (or had) the rear wheels retained only by the bearing being pressed on so it's not impossible.

Welcome to Boards by the way, I see you just joined.

Thanks Isambard,
The Boards are a great resource. I am not sure why I have not availed of it before now...

swarlb · 07-01-2020 11:28AM

Isambard wrote: »

well some cars have (or had) the rear wheels retained only by the bearing being pressed on so it's not impossible.

Welcome to Boards by the way, I see you just joined.

Irrelevant talking about 'some cars'. The model at issue is a Golf. Which has a threaded stub axle holding on an interference fit combined sealed nearing and hub. What keeps the bearing hub assembly in place is a nut and washer.
It's an impossibility for the bearing/hub to come off and for the nut/washer to remain (and remain screwed tightly)

swarlb · 07-01-2020 11:29AM

J6TM1 wrote: »

Thanks Isambard,
The Boards are a great resource. I am not sure why I have not availed of it before now...

Irony is not your strong point, is it ?

08-01-2020 07:13AM

swarlb wrote: »

Irrelevant talking about 'some cars'. The model at issue is a Golf. Which has a threaded stub axle holding on an interference fit combined sealed nearing and hub. What keeps the bearing hub assembly in place is a nut and washer.
It's an impossibility for the bearing/hub to come off and for the nut/washer to remain (and remain screwed tightly)

My gut reaction was the washer was left out or a smaller one was used

_Brian · 08-01-2020 07:19AM

When you have sudden weird sounds coming from a wheel on a car, always stop and investigate, driving on another 2km isn’t wise.

junkyarddog · 08-01-2020 06:40PM

swarlb wrote: »

Irrelevant talking about 'some cars'. The model at issue is a Golf. Which has a threaded stub axle holding on an interference fit combined sealed nearing and hub. What keeps the bearing hub assembly in place is a nut and washer.
It's an impossibility for the bearing/hub to come off and for the nut/washer to remain (and remain screwed tightly)

Mk3 Golf has two taper roller bearings fitted to the rear hub.

What the OP has described has happened before,small outer bearing fails the wheel will come off.
I've sold lots of rear stub axles for Golfs over the years because of this.

https://www.micksgarage.com/d/wheel-bearing-kits/Volkswagen/Volkswagen-Golf/GOLF-Mk-III-1991-to-1998/1-4-55-1390/products/267045-505-1869/febi-bilstein-wheel-bearing-kit

swarlb · 08-01-2020 07:17PM

junkyarddog wrote: »

Mk3 Golf has two taper roller bearings fitted to the rear hub.

What the OP has described has happened before,small outer bearing fails the wheel will come off.
I've sold lots of rear stub axles for Golfs over the years because of this.

https://www.micksgarage.com/d/wheel-bearing-kits/Volkswagen/Volkswagen-Golf/GOLF-Mk-III-1991-to-1998/1-4-55-1390/products/267045-505-1869/febi-bilstein-wheel-bearing-kit

I see what you mean. So, whoever fitted the replacements (on both wheels) as the OP stated, either didn't fit a replacement, or fitted them incorrectly, or possibly didn't do anything.

enumbers · 09-01-2020 10:28PM

possibly someone who didn't understand tightening procedures on taper bearings rather than sealed units.

pablo128 · 09-01-2020 10:38PM

I fitted and adjusted tons of these bearings. I've seen rear wheels fly off vws in mondello because of them failing.

They are an 'old' design, and were an old design even when the mk3 golf was new. To adjust them, you tightened the nut until it stopped, then backed it off a bit. It's hard to explain, it would be easier to show someone in practice. They had to be regreased at every service and adjusted. They had a castellated nut and split pin. If they were overtightened, the tapered bearing would overheat and disintegrate. When this happened, there would be nothing stopping the wheel from coming off.

If the nut was locked on, someone fcuked it up. Tbh, a young mechanic may well have never come across a wheel bearing of this type before.

pablo128 · 09-01-2020 10:40PM

swarlb wrote: »

I see what you mean. So, whoever fitted the replacements (on both wheels) as the OP stated, either didn't fit a replacement, or fitted them incorrectly, or possibly didn't do anything.

Most likely overtightened them.

J6TM1 · 10-01-2020 09:51AM

Some pics
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/m8w841j1c0kxu6x/AAArDGZEJXCV0MuPFfRyA3rEa?dl=0

J6TM1 · 10-01-2020 10:10AM

Overtightening was what myself and the very helpful farmer (with tools) were suspecting on the side of the road (… as per my initial posting).
The spanner had to be stood on to get the nut off. Possibly overeager on an pneumatic impact wrench.
The subsequent damage to the nut can be seen clearly in the pics...

Thanks for all the feedback!

J6TM1 · 10-01-2020 10:29AM

_Brian wrote: »

When you have sudden weird sounds coming from a wheel on a car, always stop and investigate, driving on another 2km isn’t wise.

Too true. If I had suspected anything like what happened I would have stopped immediately. I was a bit wary of stopping in the hard should of a motorway. In the end, I was down to 10kph on an N-road with hazard lights on so fortunately stopped in 5m - 10m in a nice roomy hard shoulder on the side. Definitely chastened by the experience & in the end probably got away quite lightly! One for the diary!

Melodeon · 10-01-2020 10:39AM

J6TM1 wrote: »

Some pics
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/m8w841j1c0kxu6x/AAArDGZEJXCV0MuPFfRyA3rEa?dl=0

That looks like classic outer bearing failure, where the tapered rollers wore down small enough to slip out of the races leaving nothing to prevent the whole wheel/hub assembly from making its escape.
Bearing failure like this is almost always a result of either gross neglect over a long time, or clumsy/incompetent assembly.
Given that the hub had just been worked on, the second option is by far the most likely.

Are new/current 'mechanics' so used to cassette hub bearings these days that they no longer know what to do with double tapered setups???

J6TM1 · 14-01-2020 10:18AM

Melodeon wrote: »

That looks like classic outer bearing failure, where the tapered rollers wore down small enough to slip out of the races leaving nothing to prevent the whole wheel/hub assembly from making its escape.
Bearing failure like this is almost always a result of either gross neglect over a long time, or clumsy/incompetent assembly.
Given that the hub had just been worked on, the second option is by far the most likely.

Are new/current 'mechanics' so used to cassette hub bearings these days that they no longer know what to do with double tapered setups???

That about sums it up! Thanks Melodeon for your input.
All the feedback from everyone much appreciated.

Stoolbend · 14-01-2020 12:55PM

Did you open that nut while it was hot?

Rear wheel came off after bearing replacement

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