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Do you think alcohol is poorly regulated?

  • 02-02-2010 03:25PM
    #1
    def
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 185 ✭✭


    Should the legal drinking age be 18?

    If not , higher or lower?

    If it was 16 (for beer and so on ) like it is in some european countrys would this reduce violence on the streets and encourage responsible use?How so?

    If it was 20 (and 18 for spirits)would this encourage responsible use or reduce violence ?How so?

    Do you think a pub or the person behind the counter should be fined ?(for selling kids drink)

    Is fining more effective then revoking a permit?

    Do you think alcohol companys should be allowed to advertise?
    Tagged:


«1

Comments

  • #2
    cian1500ww
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,904 ✭✭✭cian1500ww


    It'll make damn all difference, they'll still get the drink. I started drinking at 17 an tbh the only problem I had with ID was getting into nightclubs. Buying drink in pubs was never a problem.


  • #3
    My name is URL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,145 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    The legal age for buying it should be 21 imo, but at the end of the day if people want to drink they're going to.. it's nothing to do with regulation and everything to do with poor education on the effects of excessive drinking and the old Irish cliche that we need to be heavy drinkers


  • #4
    Red_Marauder
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,175 ✭✭✭Red_Marauder


    It's over regulated - particularly in terms of closing hours. Whatever genius decided that it was a good idea to have all mixtures of inebriated and aggravated individuals all emptying out onto the streets together at 2.30am clearly spends his weekends with a book and a cup of cocoa.

    As far as legal age goes, I think the current age isn't a huge issue. It's the attitude that's the issue.


  • #5
    the_syco
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,315 ✭✭✭✭the_syco


    def wrote: »
    If it was 16 (for beer and so on ) like it is in some european countrys would this reduce violence on the streets and encourage responsible use?How so?
    The difference between here and there is that over there, alcohol is drank in moderation when they're young, with their families. Here, it's a case of no booze till your 18, and suddenly, you can't get enough of the stuff.


  • #6
    pickarooney
    Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 35,929 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    the_syco wrote: »
    The difference between here and there is that over there, alcohol is drank in moderation when they're young, with their families. Here, it's a case of no booze till your 18, and suddenly, you can't get enough of the stuff.

    It's not really the case at all. Underage drinking is the norm in Ireland.


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  • #7
    panda100
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,551 ✭✭✭panda100


    Regaulation is a waste of time imo.
    Instead we should be looking at why so many in our society drink to excess and turn something that should be an enjoyable beverage into a destructive and dangerous habit.


  • #8
    That_Guy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 51,342 ✭✭✭✭That_Guy


    def wrote: »
    Should the legal drinking age be 18?

    Yes


    If it was 16 (for beer and so on ) like it is in some european countrys would this reduce violence on the streets and encourage responsible use?How so?

    Clearly you've never been to Dublin.
    If it was 20 (and 18 for spirits)would this encourage responsible use or reduce violence ?How so?

    If people are aggressive when they drink then it's not going to change their attitude regardless of what the legal drinking age is.
    Do you think a pub or the person behind the counter should be fined ?

    For what exactly?
    Is fining more effective then revoking a permit?

    Again... For what?
    Do you think alcohol companys should be allowed to advertise?

    Yes. It's a product at the end of the day and like most products which are advertised it's up to the individual if they wish to purchase the product in question.

    EDIT: What's your opinion OP?


  • #9
    Overheal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,729 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Red_Marauder wrote: »
    It's over regulated - particularly in terms of closing hours. Whatever genius decided that it was a good idea to have all mixtures of inebriated and aggravated individuals all emptying out onto the streets together at 2.30am clearly spends his weekends with a book and a cup of cocoa.

    As far as legal age goes, I think the current age isn't a huge issue. It's the attitude that's the issue.
    I think thats half the problem - not that they're closing at 230am, but thats seemingly all they're doing. Oh and closing on Good Friday as if it makes a difference.

    I havent seen much enforcement on the ID and sale side


  • #10
    token56
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,655 ✭✭✭token56


    Its not the regulation of alcohol thats the problems, its the attitudes that some people have towards drink. For example the drinking just to get so hammered you cant remember anything attitude.

    Alcohol is still a drug, and a lot more dangerous than some drugs which are illegal. Proper education regarding the use of it is needed in my opinion, not over regulation. Inform people at the right age about it, and I dont mean scaremongering young people into not drinking which inevitably only has the opposite reaction anyway, but proper education about alcohol. It might help with the attitudes of some people towards alcohol.


  • #11
    ejmaztec
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,260 ✭✭✭✭ejmaztec


    Don't they teach anything in schools about this drink attitude problem, or do they just sweep it under the carpet like everything else that they don't want to talk about?


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  • #12
    aidan24326
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,925 ✭✭✭aidan24326


    Red_Marauder wrote: »
    Whatever genius decided that it was a good idea to have all mixtures of inebriated and aggravated individuals all emptying out onto the streets together at 2.30am clearly spends his weekends with a book and a cup of cocoa.

    That was Brian Lenihan, who as far as I know doesn't drink at all himself. Let's just say it was not one of his brighter ideas. It really achieves nothing, nor does the stupid restriction on making off-licenses close at 10 instead of 11.


  • #13
    Mike 1972
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,018 ✭✭✭Mike 1972


    def wrote: »
    Do you think alcohol is poorly regulated?

    This is Ireland
    Name me five things which are well regulated
    Ok three things
    Ok one th.............................


  • #14
    Wazdakka
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,467 ✭✭✭Wazdakka


    aidan24326 wrote: »
    That was Brian Lenihan, who as far as I know doesn't drink at all himself. Let's just say it was not one of his brighter ideas. It really achieves nothing, nor does the stupid restriction on making off-licenses close at 10 instead of 11.

    I wonder if I'd make any money standing outside closed offies and pubs selling punching bags with his face on them..


  • #15
    token56
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,655 ✭✭✭token56


    ejmaztec wrote: »
    Don't they teach anything in schools about this drink attitude problem, or do they just sweep it under the carpet like everything else that they don't want to talk about?

    I can only talk about my experience but I'm not that long out of secondary eduction, but there was not much taught when I was there, and I dont think much has changed. I think also of the emphasis should obvioulsy be on the parents to educated their children regarding the dangers of alcohol abuse etc, but I do think the schools could have a better role in the education of teenagers about the subject also.


  • #16
    James Forde
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,785 ✭✭✭James Forde


    yes, i can't get booze past 10p.m in an off licence


  • #17
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 24,713 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    the_syco wrote: »
    The difference between here and there is that over there, alcohol is drank in moderation when they're young, with their families. Here, it's a case of no booze till your 18, and suddenly, you can't get enough of the stuff.

    This is quite a widespread myth that is sprouted regularly here in Ireland. I have worked/work with and have friends from France, Spain and Italy and they are as mad for drink as we are. They go out and get drunk regularly in there home country's and have all the stories about mad nights and they are out here doing shots with the best of us at the weekends, orgainsing the 12 pubs at xmas etc etc.

    Also especially in france they drink a lot of wine, they would go through bottles of the stuff over an evening and drink it with meals much more regularly then we do here.

    To answer the op's question I think its poorly regulated. Off licenses closing at 10pm and pubs/night clubs having closing at 2:30 is ridiculous.


  • #18
    Mike 1972
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,018 ✭✭✭Mike 1972


    bryanjf wrote: »
    i can't get booze past 10p.m in an off licence

    This is all based on the assumption that people who drink alcohol tend to have poor skills when it comes to foward planning

    Which in a lot of cases would appear to be indeed the case ?


  • #19
    Jay P
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,944 ✭✭✭Jay P


    It's regulated fine I think. The problem is that people think it's acceptable to go out and get plastered every weekend the minute they turn 18. As a nation we're not educated enough about the effects of alcohol.

    Though if offies were open after ten, that'd be seriously handy. I can't really make a last minute decision to go out because it ends up costing so much to drink in a pub/club.


  • #20
    pooch90
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,414 ✭✭✭pooch90


    Pro's and cons...
    def wrote: »
    If it was 16 (for beer and so on ) like it is in some european countrys would this reduce violence on the streets and encourage responsible use?How so?
    If your in a pub at least your not walking the streets throwing bottles at cars and you will have to behave or leave - you'll be sent home if you get too drunk or act like a twat(seperated from your mates).

    def wrote: »
    If it was 20 (and 18 for spirits)would this encourage responsible use or reduce violence ?How so?
    If it was 20 full stop then at least you wouldn't have school kids buying for their mates.

    Trouble is with age limits that you always get a transition period where some in a group can get drink for everyone else - even if they have to drink it in a dark field to socialise together...


  • #21
    ScumLord
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,789 ✭✭✭✭ScumLord


    def wrote: »
    If it was 16 (for beer and so on ) like it is in some european countrys would this reduce violence on the streets and encourage responsible use?How so?
    Why should beer be given to younger people? You seem to be working under the incorrect assumption that beer is some sort of alcohol light. Just because it's got bubbles in it doesn't mean it's suitable for kids. Larger and cider get into your system rapidly, you'd almost be better off drinking spirits.


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  • #22
    def
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 185 ✭✭def


    That_Guy wrote: »

    Clearly you've never been to Dublin.

    If people are aggressive when they drink then it's not going to change their attitude regardless of what the legal drinking age is.

    i was born and bred in the kip(and love it)

    if drunk 16 year olds were taken out of the streets and into pubs it could stop the "on the nak" culture where it starts ,,, young kids drinking where they can do it and get away with it( not pubs) and reduce contact with people there (streets and feilds )who see them as a easy target

    Quote:
    Do you think a pub or the person behind the counter should be fined ?
    For what exactly?

    sorry selling kids drink:rolleyes:(ill edit that,thanks for pointing it out)
    Yes. It's a product at the end of the day and like most products which are advertised it's up to the individual if they wish to purchase the product in question.

    thats what i think
    What's your opinion OP?

    thanks for asking:)


  • #23
    Mike 1972
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,018 ✭✭✭Mike 1972


    def wrote: »
    Should the legal drinking age be 18?

    Its not

    The legal age for buying alcohol is 18


  • #24
    token56
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,655 ✭✭✭token56


    Mike 1972 wrote: »
    Its not

    The legal age for buying alcohol is 18

    Indeed if you under 18 you can't drink alcohol unless you are in a private residence and have permission from your parents.


  • #25
    strobe
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,872 ✭✭✭strobe


    Jay P wrote: »
    As a nation we're not educated enough about the effects of alcohol.

    I see a few people saying this, we need more education. I'm all for education but would it make the slightest bit of difference at all? Is there a single 14 year old in the country that would come out of a school run education dealy on alcohol and say "wow, I didn't know that about alcohol. Really it can make make you do things you wouldn't normally do? It can be addictive?" ect. What exactly are we going to educate people about that they don't all already know? Everyone young and old knows, for example, it's not a good idea to drink loads of drink really quickly on a night out, they just choose to do it anyways.


  • #26
    def
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 185 ✭✭def


    token56 wrote: »
    Its not the regulation of alcohol thats the problems, its the attitudes that some people have towards drink. For example the drinking just to get so hammered you cant remember anything attitude.

    how does this attitude develope, thats the question where i am now the legal age for beer is 16 , and drinking outdoors any where is legal, and i have never seen a group of drunk teens hangin around drunk or otherwise,

    maybe takin kids indoors is the key ,,, even ones who dont like sports...


  • #27
    Jay P
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,944 ✭✭✭Jay P


    strobe wrote: »
    I see a few people saying this, we need more education. I'm all for education but would it make the slightest bit of difference at all? Is there a single 14 year old in the country that would come out of a school run education dealy on alcohol and say "wow, I didn't know that about alcohol. Really it can make make you do things you wouldn't normally do? It can be addictive?" ect. What exactly are we going to educate people about that they don't all already know? Everyone young and old knows, for example, it's not a good idea to drink loads of drink really quickly on a night out, they just choose to do it anyways.

    I can't really see it turning people off wanting to drink, but it might turn people off drinking as much as humanly possible.
    Maybe introducing kids to people with addiction problems might be one solution. I know that when I was in TY it made me think a lot more about alcohol when three men from AA came in to talk to us.

    Saying that is kind of like saying that there's no point educating kids about the dangers of unprotected sex because they already know all about sex. It doesn't really make sense.


  • #28
    senbwcs
    Closed Accounts Posts: 25 ✭senbwcs


    Mike 1972 wrote: »
    This is all based on the assumption that people who drink alcohol tend to have poor skills when it comes to foward planning

    Which in a lot of cases would appear to be indeed the case ?

    Plenty of people only finish work late in the evening, I've seen people in Tesco who clearly just finished work and are picking up their dinner and a few beers or a bottle of wine get turned away because it's 10:01pm.

    Also, the old off-licence closing time was 11:30, not 11 as people keep saying.


  • #29
    def
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 185 ✭✭def


    token56 wrote: »
    I can only talk about my experience but I'm not that long out of secondary eduction, but there was not much taught when I was there, and I dont think much has changed. I think also of the emphasis should obvioulsy be on the parents to educated their children regarding the dangers of alcohol abuse etc, but I do think the schools could have a better role in the education of teenagers about the subject also.


    parents who do a bad job at raising there kids need something /someone to blame ,"if schools are supposed to be teaching our children... it must be their fault"

    every child on the first day of school should be given a list of what there parents should have /should soon teach them ,, parents should be your main educater ,not some person at the top of a room you go to everyday who shouts at you and tells you your not allowed go to the toilet etc

    this is not the type of authority figure kids need to learn this stuff from " if this guys such a failure ,should i do the oppisite to avoid becoming a failure in life?"


  • #30
    Atavan-Halen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,183 ✭✭✭✭Atavan-Halen


    bryanjf wrote: »
    yes, i can't get booze past 10p.m in an off licence

    Wasn't that to cut down on underage drinking? Pretty pointless as most teenagers have their drink by 8-9pm before going out.


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  • #31
    Wazdakka
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,467 ✭✭✭Wazdakka


    atavan-halen wrote: »
    Wasn't that to cut down on underage drinking? Pretty pointless as most teenagers have their drink by 8-9pm before going out.

    Don't get me fúcking started :mad:
    I could write a bloody thesis on how stupid that one was and how everyone just let them get away with it..


  • #32
    DrumSteve
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,798 ✭✭✭✭DrumSteve


    def wrote: »
    Should the legal drinking age be 18?

    If not , higher or lower?

    If it was 16 (for beer and so on ) like it is in some european countrys would this reduce violence on the streets and encourage responsible use?How so?

    If it was 20 (and 18 for spirits)would this encourage responsible use or reduce violence ?How so?

    Do you think a pub or the person behind the counter should be fined ?(for selling kids drink)

    Is fining more effective then revoking a permit?

    Do you think alcohol companys should be allowed to advertise?


    Are you writing a book? thats a lot of questions....

    Alcohol is overly regulated, which, when coupled with Irish Peoples love for getting "one up" on the system, means we(for the most part) abuse it totally.

    Whats needed is a change in attitude from everyone in this country. some people think its a badge of honour that they're irish and solely due to this fact they can drink anyone under the table.


  • #33
    Wazdakka
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,467 ✭✭✭Wazdakka


    DrumSteve wrote: »
    Are you writing a book? thats a lot of questions....
    .

    Probably a college paper..
    Have you seen his other threads?

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055816791
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055815140

    *looks suspiciously at OP*


  • #34
    Herbal Deity
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,397 ✭✭✭Herbal Deity


    ejmaztec wrote: »
    Don't they teach anything in schools about this drink attitude problem, or do they just sweep it under the carpet like everything else that they don't want to talk about?
    I recall being taught how utterly dreadful alcohol was.

    What was puzzling at 12 years old was why people would bother drinking alcohol in the first place if all it did was caused dizziness, was detrimental to motor skills, coordination, cognition, induced nausea etc.

    Biased teaching of only the negatives has no effect.


  • #35
    def
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 185 ✭✭def


    Briana Rhythmic Sidekick wrote: »
    To answer the op's question I think its over regulated. Off licenses closing at 10pm and pubs/night clubs having closing at 2:30 is ridiculous.

    i think you mean poorly regulated ,, to strict on people who should be able to choose for themselves , to easy for kids to get it / not enough to stop people giving it to them / stop them using spirits


  • #36
    RobbieTheRobber
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,022 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber


    atavan-halen wrote: »
    Wasn't that to cut down on underage drinking? Pretty pointless as most teenagers have their drink by 8-9pm before going out.

    Wasn't that to try and reduce the binge drinking culture?

    Most self proclaimed free speech absolutists are giant big whiny snowflakes!



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  • #37
    def
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 185 ✭✭def


    ScumLord wrote: »
    Why should beer be given to younger people? You seem to be working under the incorrect assumption that beer is some sort of alcohol light. Just because it's got bubbles in it doesn't mean it's suitable for kids. Larger and cider get into your system rapidly, you'd almost be better off drinking spirits.


    yes but in my mind beer is for socialising ,spirits is for getting locked out of your brains , and once you have downed that nagon theres no going back

    also spirits make some people very agro


  • #38
    toiletduck
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,379 ✭✭✭toiletduck


    Way too over-regulated as it is.


  • #39
    token56
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,655 ✭✭✭token56


    def wrote: »
    parents who do a bad job at raising there kids need something /someone to blame ,"if schools are supposed to be teaching our children... it must be their fault"

    every child on the first day of school should be given a list of what there parents should have /should soon teach them ,, parents should be your main educater ,not some person at the top of a room you go to everyday who shouts at you and tells you your not allowed go to the toilet etc

    this is not the type of authority figure kids need to learn this stuff from " if this guys such a failure ,should i do the oppisite to avoid becoming a failure in life?"

    I completely agree the book should stop with the parent, they should be your main educator on things like this. But there is a whole other discussion which could probably be had regarding bad parenting, on even kids seen alcohol abuse in the home and thinking its acceptable etc. But its probably better to be discussed another time.

    I also agree the teacher and school normally has a negative attachment with things like authority and people telling you things you shouldn't be doing etc but it is still the best place to reach children as a group. While drinking problems are often related to the individual, there are also problems associated with group mentalities that can build up regarding what is acceptable with drink and drunken behavior. I think school is good place to try help with this group mentality that can sometimes build up. Also it doesn't have to be a teacher educating about this sort of stuff but possibly someone different who kids or young teenagers could possibly related to. There are bad aspects of alcohol which should be taught, but it doesn't all have to be negative stuff.


  • #40
    def
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 185 ✭✭def


    strobe wrote: »
    I see a few people saying this, we need more education. I'm all for education but would it make the slightest bit of difference at all? Is there a single 14 year old in the country that would come out of a school run education dealy on alcohol and say "wow, I didn't know that about alcohol. Really it can make make you do things you wouldn't normally do? It can be addictive?" ect. What exactly are we going to educate people about that they don't all already know? Everyone young and old knows, for example, it's not a good idea to drink loads of drink really quickly on a night out, they just choose to do it anyways.


    i think ,,, making the legal age for buying beer 16 and spirtits at 18/20 would send a strong message "educating" people that drinking is /should be about socialising not getting plastered ,and as a side effect take "kids" off streets ,they could go somewhere even if they couldnt afford to get drunk and if they misbehave they get kicked out .... thus giving them a reason to behave if they get told to move along in the streets ,,, thats it they just move up the road ,, once you drink in a pub a feild is a whole lot less appealing


  • #41
    def
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 185 ✭✭def


    Jay P wrote: »
    I can't really see it turning people off wanting to drink, but it might turn people off drinking as much as humanly possible.
    Maybe introducing kids to people with addiction problems might be one solution. I know that when I was in TY it made me think a lot more about alcohol when three men from AA came in to talk to us.

    Saying that is kind of like saying that there's no point educating kids about the dangers of unprotected sex because they already know all about sex. It doesn't really make sense.


    scare tactics are never very good , and i feel are a sign of either a sign of a lack of creativity in policy makers or some degree hatered in policy makers


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  • #42
    def
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 185 ✭✭def


    DrumSteve wrote: »
    Are you writing a book? thats a lot of questions....

    naw ,maybe i should or at least a few leaflets,,

    it was just so people wouldnt say yes/no ,,


  • #43
    token56
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,655 ✭✭✭token56


    strobe wrote: »
    I see a few people saying this, we need more education. I'm all for education but would it make the slightest bit of difference at all? Is there a single 14 year old in the country that would come out of a school run education dealy on alcohol and say "wow, I didn't know that about alcohol. Really it can make make you do things you wouldn't normally do? It can be addictive?" ect. What exactly are we going to educate people about that they don't all already know? Everyone young and old knows, for example, it's not a good idea to drink loads of drink really quickly on a night out, they just choose to do it anyways.

    It doesn't have to be just teaching that "alcohol can be bad and unhealthy, you can become addicted etc". They can be taught its ok to consume alcohol in moderation etc. They can also be taught about acceptable behavior when drunk, serious stuff. Not just things that you yourself may do but as a group and also things that may be done to you. I've a bit of a grip with things like how consensual is consenting to sex when extremely drunk, this is probably more a humanities issue regardless. But anyway I think there are plenty of things that could be done in school that can improve kids future experiences of alcohol. I'm not trying to say take all the fun out it but just educate them that it can be used for fun without all the anti social behavior that is associated with it.

    Maybe it wont make a difference, but I dont see much else being done in trying to help some of the drinking attitudes this country has and it is at least something which can be tried.


  • #44
    def
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 185 ✭✭def


    token56 wrote: »

    there are also problems associated with group mentalities that can build up regarding what is acceptable with drink and drunken behavior.

    cool kid at break after learning about drink " wats dat tik takin bout ,gettin locked in rapid"

    other kids "but where can we get it ?"

    cool k " down the offo beside ***** ,no boder , giv it to any one , get a nagen do ,its well cheaper ,just down it"

    who do the kids pay more attention to?

    they say (teachers)do you not think teachers talk to each other?


  • #45
    token56
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,655 ✭✭✭token56


    def wrote: »
    cool kid at break after learning about drink " wats dat tik takin bout ,gettin locked in rapid"

    other kids "but where can we get it ?"

    cool k " down the offo beside ***** ,no boder , giv it to any one , get a nagen do ,its well cheaper ,just down it"

    who do the kids pay more attention to?

    they say (teachers)do you not think teachers talk to each other?

    sorry I'm not exactly sure what the point being made is?


  • #46
    Overheal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,729 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    I think another factor is Repurcussions or lack thereof.

    There is a serious air/underlying attitude in this country that the courts are not living up to their end of the bargain. Eddie ****ing Halvey - 7 months suspended sentence for drunk driving and Vehicular Manslaughter.

    Honestly what Deterrent is there to a Pleb to drink responsibly? Sweet F*ck All.


  • #47
    def
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 185 ✭✭def


    token56 wrote: »
    It doesn't have to be just teaching that "alcohol can be bad and unhealthy, you can become addicted etc". They can be taught its ok to consume alcohol in moderation etc. They can also be taught about acceptable behavior when drunk, serious stuff.

    Maybe it wont make a difference, but I dont see much else being done in trying to help some of the drinking attitudes this country has and it is at least something which can be tried.


    if drinking alcohol "in moderation " was taught as ok it would definately bring up some ackwerd questions about the next most used recreational drug which all the kids can buy because theres no age limit on it ... if you follow me


  • #48
    def
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 185 ✭✭def


    token56 wrote: »
    sorry I'm not exactly sure what the point being made is?


    group / herd mentality follow the "leader"


  • #49
    def
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 185 ✭✭def


    Overheal wrote: »
    I think another factor is Repurcussions or lack thereof.

    There is a serious air/underlying attitude in this country that the courts are not living up to their end of the bargain. Eddie ****ing Halvey - 7 months suspended sentence for drunk driving and Vehicular Manslaughter.

    Honestly what Deterrent is there to a Pleb to drink responsibly? Sweet F*ck All.


    thats my point exactly about bringing 16 year olds into pubs , misbehave your kicked out ,keep it up your barred , act like a kid older people give you funny looks or a bit of abuse ,,

    it would completely change the mind set ,and get them off the streets

    from my experiances if you have a group of kids 15+ (years of age)on the streets ,doing nothing , no where else to go ,it will only take one bad apple to set the rest down that road

    very quickly they realise ,hey if this guy can rob 300+ cars get caught only 20 times and of those spend a few weeks locked up , total , they all very quickly have no respect for any law , if they wana do somthing they do it ,if a gardai comes along hes not the long arm of the law ,hes just this guy whos "spoiling their fun" ,the fact pot has no age limit doesnt help either (so they all do that and get away with it)

    this is very dangerous for society in general, unfotunately ,i would say most people dont think" why is that kid a violent little thug ?",they just think " that kid is a violent little thug"

    this is the attitude that needs to be addressed ,so possible problems are prevented not just delt with poorly when they happen


  • #50
    Jay P
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,944 ✭✭✭Jay P


    def wrote: »
    i think ,,, making the legal age for buying beer 16 and spirtits at 18/20 would send a strong message "educating" people that drinking is /should be about socialising not getting plastered ,and as a side effect take "kids" off streets ,they could go somewhere even if they couldnt afford to get drunk and if they misbehave they get kicked out .... thus giving them a reason to behave if they get told to move along in the streets ,,, thats it they just move up the road ,, once you drink in a pub a feild is a whole lot less appealing

    No, lowering the drinking age would do a whole lot of damage. I don't see how it could be seen as a good thing. It'd just encourage kids to drink more, and to start even younger.


  • #51
    Overheal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,729 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Jay P wrote: »
    No, lowering the drinking age would do a whole lot of damage. I don't see how it could be seen as a good thing. It'd just encourage kids to drink more, and to start even younger.
    Tricky subject. One school of thought is that it reinforces the idea that Drinking is not something you need to Hide or be Ashamed of. And that in turn would lead to fewer closet alcoholics in Denial. I started drinking at 16, in pubs. My parents knew - werent happy about it, but much gladder it was a pub. The Publican happened to be an ex Cop. Frankly it was a safe place to learn my limit. And nowadays I barely drink at all.

    The other is I guess the US school of thought, where the age is 21 and while underage drinking goes on theres certainly a different culture to it. But that basically makes it a completely different scenario and not all that relevant to the Irish scenario. The big difference though is Deterrence, if you get in an accident from drunk driving you could face 5 years or More. Right now thats just not really happening in Ireland. Its a far too lenient system based on blind Forgiveness.


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