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Help with escaped POW/Airman

  • 21-06-2011 12:51PM
    #1
    pavb2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,143 ✭✭✭


    Hi All I remember reading an obituary about 10 + years ago.of an escaped POW/airman in Norway or Scandanavia.

    Anyway he got to a farmhouse a woman said she would tell small son to get help when in fact she told him to get the police.

    She didn't realise POW/airman could speak the language & understood her. He then shot them both.

    I know its a bit vague but does anyone have any details on this story?


Comments

  • #2
    marcsignal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,072 ✭✭✭marcsignal


    just did a search for info on that OP, couldn't find anything so far.


  • #3
    Morlar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,273 ✭✭✭Morlar


    This isn't ringing any bells with me either. I presume you are referring to an RAF airman ? The story sounds like something out of a movie to be honest.


  • #4
    pavb2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,143 ✭✭✭pavb2


    Thanks lads for taking the time, does sound like a movie but I read it in an obituary The Sunday Times many years ago the story was inserted at the end almost as a footnote.

    Will keep digging


  • #5
    Fratton Fred
    Closed Accounts Posts: 26,567 ✭✭✭✭Fratton Fred


    Three things don't ring true.

    A Norwegian giving up an allied soldier. They were pretty much all involved in some form of resistance

    A (presumed) RAF pilot speaking Norwegian

    A (presumed) RAF pilot shooting a woman and child.

    Substitute Norwegian for any Scandinavian nationality.


  • #6
    Morlar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,273 ✭✭✭Morlar


    Fratton Fred wrote: »
    Three things don't ring true.

    A Norwegian giving up an allied soldier. They were pretty much all involved in some form of resistance

    A (presumed) RAF pilot speaking Norwegian

    A (presumed) RAF pilot shooting a woman and child.

    Substitute Norwegian for any Scandinavian nationality.

    How about if small details of the story are incorrect ?

    How about German civilians ? Or Dutch ?

    The Germans recruited everywhere they invaded, they also lived there for several years and had many local connections and supporters. There is also the element of fear of consequences of not turning downed pilots in.

    I don't believe the story as I think it would be more well known if it were true.

    However I don't share your belief that a british service man would be incapable of that on principle.

    Having said that I can think of no examples of downed pilots of either side shooting civilians to evade capture/re-capture, though I would not be overly surprised if it happened at some point.


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  • #7
    Fratton Fred
    Closed Accounts Posts: 26,567 ✭✭✭✭Fratton Fred


    Sarcasm doesn't work too well on t'internet.

    If any of the small details were to change I don't think it would make too much difference, unless it was an enemy airman, ie an RAF pilot shot down in Germany, although as you say, reports of this aren't exactly common.

    I have heard of German airman being given a beating in London and British airman being given a beating in Berlin.


  • #8
    jonniebgood1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,578 ✭✭✭jonniebgood1


    Morlar wrote: »
    .............
    I don't believe the story as I think it would be more well known if it were true.

    .............

    Having said that I can think of no examples of downed pilots of either side shooting civilians to evade capture/re-capture, though I would not be overly surprised if it happened at some point.

    You don't believe the story, yet you think it may have happened??? which?


    If OP has any more information it will help searching for the story as it sounds interesting.


  • #9
    Morlar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,273 ✭✭✭Morlar


    jonniebgood1 wrote: »
    You don't believe the story, yet you think it may have happened??? which?

    It's quite clear actually.

    What I said was I don't believe this story as I believe it would have been more well known if it were true.

    At the same time I don't share Fred's belief that a british serviceman would be incapable of it on principle.

    Or for that matter if slight details were different, the RAF also had a lot of Polish Pilots, some RAF pilots would also know european languages.

    As well as that the notion that all norwegians were in the resistance, or even sympathetic to them is also off the wall.


  • #10
    citizen_p
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,494 ✭✭✭citizen_p


    Fratton Fred wrote: »
    I have heard of German airman being given a beating in London and British airman being given a beating in Berlin.

    well if the guys who were bombing your city landing in your back garden, I doubt they would get a warm welcome... mob justice must've occured once or twice.

    Just as with most westren European nations I would assume a few escaped to britian and kept on fighting.


    Norweigian RAF squadrons


  • #11
    Fratton Fred
    Closed Accounts Posts: 26,567 ✭✭✭✭Fratton Fred


    Mousey- wrote: »
    well if the guys who were bombing your city landing in your back garden, I doubt they would get a warm welcome... mob justice must've occured once or twice.

    Mob justice was one thing, but parachutes were also made out of silk, a real luxury in 1940s Britain.

    Apparently Luftwaffe pilots were in danger of being mugged by gangs of women after a few yards of material!


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  • #12
    spurious
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 27,352 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    Who survived to tell the story?
    The airman?
    Doesn't sound like something you'd go round telling people about tbh.


  • #13
    Norwayviking
    Closed Accounts Posts: 766 ✭✭✭Norwayviking


    pavb2 wrote: »
    Hi All I remember reading an obituary about 10 + years ago.of an escaped POW/airman in Norway or Scandanavia.

    Anyway he got to a farmhouse a woman said she would tell small son to get help when in fact she told him to get the police.

    She didn't realise POW/airman could speak the language & understood her. He then shot them both.

    I know its a bit vague but does anyone have any details on this story?

    You are probably thinking of this incident
    during ww2 in Norway
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jan_Baalsrud


  • #14
    xflyer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,787 ✭✭✭xflyer


    The original story does seem a bit unlikely not least because an escaped POW would be unlikely to be carrying a gun. A downed pilot might be. But it's quite possible.

    On the point of airman being beaten by mobs on the ground. It did go on. It's well documented in Germany and there were several high profile incidents. But it did happen in Britain too. I read of one incident where a Luftwaffe pilot left hanging in powerlines by his parachute was attacked by women wielding knives. He died. But the biggest clue is the number of shot down RAF pilots during the battle of Britain who were shot, shot at or physically attacked when they landed. In one case I read of a pilot was sitting in a farmhouse when a policeman stormed in and slapped him in the face. That's just the British aircrew many who saved themselves by identifying themselves as British. The famous RAF VC James Nicholson having escaped a burning aircraft was shot by Home Guardsmen as he descended in his parachute.

    You can extrapolate that there must be have been several cases where Luftwaffe aircrew were simply shot or beaten to death by furious locals. It would be easy to say he resisted or attacked you. Given the times there would be precious little sympathy.

    I'd say there's a few stories there somewhere.


  • #15
    Norwayviking
    Closed Accounts Posts: 766 ✭✭✭Norwayviking


    xflyer wrote: »
    The original story does seem a bit unlikely not least because an escaped POW would be unlikely to be carrying a gun. A downed pilot might be. But it's quite possible.

    On the point of airman being beaten by mobs on the ground. It did go on. It's well documented in Germany and there were several high profile incidents. But it did happen in Britain too. I read of one incident where a Luftwaffe pilot left hanging in powerlines by his parachute was attacked by women wielding knives. He died. But the biggest clue is the number of shot down RAF pilots during the battle of Britain who were shot, shot at or physically attacked when they landed. In one case I read of a pilot was sitting in a farmhouse when a policeman stormed in and slapped him in the face. That's just the British aircrew many who saved themselves by identifying themselves as British. The famous RAF VC James Nicholson having escaped a burning aircraft was shot by Home Guardsmen as he descended in his parachute.

    You can extrapolate that there must be have been several cases where Luftwaffe aircrew were simply shot or beaten to death by furious locals. It would be easy to say he resisted or attacked you. Given the times there would be precious little sympathy.

    I'd say there's a few stories there somewhere.


    Yes thats true.I am sure theres many stories around that was never recorded.
    One incident too in Norway i can think of is operation Freshman.
    Although this was recorded.
    The first attempt to attack the heavy water plant in Rjukan,Telemark in Norway ended in Disaster for many British commandos and airccrew.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Freshman


  • #16
    xflyer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,787 ✭✭✭xflyer


    Yes indeed, Hitler's well known Commando order. But the problem with war is that it brutalises people or gives accomodation to people with a nasty side. It empowers people to act in a way that they wouldn't otherwise consider.

    Human nature.


  • #17
    Norwayviking
    Closed Accounts Posts: 766 ✭✭✭Norwayviking


    xflyer wrote: »
    Yes indeed, Hitler's well known Commando order. But the problem with war is that it brutalises people or gives accomodation to people with a nasty side. It empowers people to act in a way that they wouldn't otherwise consider.

    Human nature.

    True indeed,at the end of the day its really nothing positive about war:D:D


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