320 s class mercedes not starting

goat2 · 04-03-2012 07:49PM #1

my friend bought one of these a few days ago,
problem is,
it sometimes does not start for no reason, it was in our yard today, he drove it in, then an hour later it would not start, and a few hours later he tried it again, and it started, this has been the pattern with the past three days,
yet when they put the computer to it, it does not show anything,

04-03-2012 07:51PM

What happens when it doesn't start? Does it turn over? Your fairly scant on the actual details.

goat2 · 04-03-2012 08:12PM

the key turns, and not a pick, it does not crank, it is a pity, its a beautiful car, all the clocks in the dash dont come on also,
and then a couple hours later it is like, it never happened, mystery to him

04-03-2012 08:14PM

Earth or ignition would be the places to start having a peak at.
It's not surprising nothing shows up on diagnostics.

goat2 · 04-03-2012 08:16PM

RoverJames wrote: »

Earth or ignition would be the places to start having a peak at.
It's not surprising nothing shows up on diagnostics.

thank you for that, i will phone him with that,
this car is like a computer on wheels, when it started this evening i sat in for a spin, comfort was awsome

Nissan doctor · 04-03-2012 08:20PM

Not unusual for the ECU's to fail on these due to water getting down into the loom.

Bobo78 · 04-03-2012 09:32PM

Ouch I wouldnt like to be hit with that kind of bill

What do you recon they would cost to fix on car like this?

Nissan doctor · 05-03-2012 12:19AM

Bobo78 wrote: »

Ouch I wouldnt like to be hit with that kind of bill
What do you recon they would cost to fix on car like this?

Early W220 models are worth practically nothing these days so the repair could very easily be more then the value of the car.

Having said that..it may be as simple as a bad connection in the ignition switch or similar.

@OP, what model is the car?

goat2 · 05-03-2012 12:37AM

it is 02 petrol,

200yrolecrank · 05-03-2012 12:41AM

goat2 wrote: »

it is 02 petrol,

Ouch
Take it up north if it's anything serious as the merc garages down here will cost you.

Nissan doctor · 05-03-2012 12:46AM

goat2 wrote: »

it is 02 petrol,

Its unfortunately their endless, often expensive, electrical problems that has them worth so little.

I'd have gone for a lexus LS430 of the same sort of age, better made and almost completely trouble free.

Check the very simple things like battery connections and earth points etc but beyond that you'll need someone with the correct equipment and knowalage to diagnose further.

goat2 · 05-03-2012 12:49AM

it has 3 mechanics stumped at the moment, hopeing to get to the bottom of it, it has been checked by the computer thingy, nothing is showing up, but then again when this problem happens, nothings working anyway, and when it starts and runs, it tells him that all is fine,
only problem with this, one would not want to travel far when it does start, because if it does not start, they would be in a right mess.

goat2 · 05-03-2012 12:54AM

Nissan doctor wrote: »

Its unfortunately their endless, often expensive, electrical problems that has them worth so little.

I'd have gone for a lexus LS430 of the same sort of age, better made and almost completely trouble free.

Check the very simple things like battery connections and earth points etc but beyond that you'll need someone with the correct equipment and knowalage to diagnose further.

has been checked out by correct equipment, and shows a healthy result, and this is still happening.
key turns fully, and not a click out of it, the equipment on the dash does not come on while it is in this way,
then a few hours later when he sits in it would start up again as if nothing ever happened

Nissan doctor · 05-03-2012 01:04AM

goat2 wrote: »

has been checked out by correct equipment, and shows a healthy result, and this is still happening.
key turns fully, and not a click out of it, the equipment on the dash does not come on while it is in this way,
then a few hours later when he sits in it would start up again as if nothing ever happened

Plugging in a diagnostic computer and looking for fault codes is unlikely to be the correct equipment for finding a pre ECU electrical fault.

goat2 · 05-03-2012 01:09AM

he is starting to realize this,

goat2 · 05-03-2012 10:41AM

it would not budge again today, i thought that it needed to be cold to start properly, but i was wrong, it did it again now and it was cold. i have forwarded what feedback i am getting here, he is agreeing with nissan to start small and look at starter and wiring along with earthing, hope it bring good results

05-03-2012 11:19AM

When it's not starting and dead as a doornail are the likes of the interior light and radio coming on?

eddieham · 05-03-2012 11:25AM

If you havent already done so I would suggest signing up to and posting your problem on the following

http://www.mbclub.co.uk
www.benzworld.org

I have solved many issues by using both these sites, the members are always very helpful and will usually point you in the right direction if they cant solve.

Alternatively you could ring Ned Kelly in Kilkenny, is a real gent and will usually do whatever he can over the phone, to try and help you. Many other merc specialists out there also, but I only have experience of using Ned when stuck

goat2 · 05-03-2012 12:04PM

RoverJames wrote: »

When it's not starting and dead as a doornail are the likes of the interior light and radio coming on?

i will ask that question when i see him, if it is the case that they are also not working which i suspect is the case, what would he be looking for then,
i am glad i drive an old banger at moment, easy get parts and anyone can fix the problems, a simple working car

05-03-2012 12:08PM

goat2 wrote: »

i will ask that question when i see him, if it is the case that they are also not working which i suspect is the case, what would he be looking for then,...........

Well if absolutely nothing at all in powered up it would look to be an earth.
However if the central locking was working seconds before hand I would expect the interior light to be on too.

Worth checking though.

Eric Cartman · 05-03-2012 02:08PM

Nissan doctor wrote: »

goat2 wrote: »

it is 02 petrol,

I'd have gone for a lexus LS430 of the same sort of age, better made and almost completely trouble free.

The LS430 is a lovely car , but its not in the same leauge as the s class or 7 series , its just not as well equipped and doesnt have the same percieved luxury about it

pcardin · 05-03-2012 02:39PM

I had the similar problem on my '00 Mercedes E200 Kompressor. Everything was allright but sometimes it was dead. Found the problem fairly quickly (after a few embarrassing moments) - black fat wire (cable) from battery to earth was a bit loose on other (body) side. Because connection was loose but not completeley off sometimes radio and all other stuff worked but wasn't enough power to start the car. Sometimes everything was stone dead.

Nissan doctor · 05-03-2012 09:52PM

Eric Cartman wrote: »

The LS430 is a lovely car , but its not in the same leauge as the s class or 7 series , its just not as well equipped and doesnt have the same percieved luxury about it

Perceived luxury or quality only appeals to people who don't know anything about cars.

I'd rather have an actual quality product then a substandard product made to 'feel' quality. Most w220's that are still on the road a clinging to life by their finger nails, never mind the fact that most are starting to rust badly already.

Owen · 05-03-2012 09:55PM

I fixed an SLK recently that wouldn't start every now and again. Owner had replaced the starter, had Star Diagnostics plugged in and there were no faults logged. Turned out that the starter relay (Not replaceable, soldered in jobbie) had a lot of cracked solder joints on the board. I reflowed all the solder joints on that board for all the relays, and it hasn't had an ounce of bother since.

lomb · 06-03-2012 01:37AM

Owen wrote: »

I fixed an SLK recently that wouldn't start every now and again. Owner had replaced the starter, had Star Diagnostics plugged in and there were no faults logged. Turned out that the starter relay (Not replaceable, soldered in jobbie) had a lot of cracked solder joints on the board. I reflowed all the solder joints on that board for all the relays, and it hasn't had an ounce of bother since.

Where abouts is that board for the relays?

Owen · 06-03-2012 08:34AM

It's inside a black module box with a thick loom going into it, on the SLK it was at the top right of the engine bay, may be in a different location in yours.

Owen · 06-03-2012 08:35AM

Also, at first glance the solder joints looked fine, it was only under a magnifying glass that I could see the cracks, so reflow them all regardless if you think they're okay.

goat2 · 07-03-2012 11:50AM

car was not driven in last two days, but started at least ten times and seemed all was fine, this morning he carried car to work about an hour away, five minuits before reaching destination, clocks on dash started shutting down, heaters shut down, and when he stopped it, it would not restart

07-03-2012 12:12PM

...... so the heaters and lights went off but the engine was still running, when he pulled over he turned off the engine and it wouldn't restart?

goat2 · 07-03-2012 02:53PM

yes, and a few hours later it started, as if nothings wrong, they are now thinking it is a sensor for the heat, could that be the trouble, at least now he has garned a little bit more information, that being, that the clocks on dash and heating stop working while driving for an hour or so, then it will start when cold, as if nothing happened

mickdw · 07-03-2012 04:34PM

Nissan doctor wrote: »

I'd rather have an actual quality product then a substandard product made to 'feel' quality. Most w220's that are still on the road a clinging to life by their finger nails, never mind the fact that most are starting to rust badly already.

I wouldnt agree that w220 are only hanging on in there. They were made up to 05 or 06.Sure a few of the ropey early ones that were electrically problematic are borderline scrap at this stage but there are many many very fine examples yet out there.

Nissan doctor · 07-03-2012 10:28PM

mickdw wrote: »

I wouldnt agree that w220 are only hanging on in there. They were made up to 05 or 06.Sure a few of the ropey early ones that were electrically problematic are borderline scrap at this stage but there are many many very fine examples yet out there.

They are the guts of 100k cars....you'd hope that the 05/06 ones should still be going reasonably well and you could argue that if they were quality products, they would all be still going well unless crashed.

The point I was making is that early most ones are riddles with problems and are just one failure away from the scrap heap...where as early 00's LS430's, even with well over 100k on the clock, are still running like the day they left the factory and are almost completely problem free.

Swampy · 07-03-2012 10:37PM

if it's automatic. perhaps the parking switch in the gear box.

Occasionally on my jag, this happens. I just give the gear stick in P a quick wiggle and its starts up perfect.

goat2 · 09-03-2012 05:37PM

they think it is something to do with the gear, thing thinking it is in park, the part is a colossal price, so hope it will be fixed once and for all

Owen · 09-03-2012 05:51PM

Did they inspect the relay box I spoke about earlier?

goat2 · 09-03-2012 07:57PM

i think they did, but the car would not budge out of park about two hours ago, seems it has a mind of its own, he stopped and pulled over to answer phone, put car in park, when he wanted to take off, it would not budge out of park, also all the clocks shut down just before he pulled over

I Was VB · 10-03-2012 04:55AM

Such a shame as they were a great looking car.

lomb · 10-03-2012 07:04AM

Its obvious whoever sold it was because of that fault..
What would a 02 or 03 BMW 7 series be like? Seem like an amazing piece of kit for the money.

goat2 · 24-03-2012 07:42PM

updating you all on this not starting problem, got to the end of it,
it was wiring that had gotten wet and had started to degrade at the connections, so it was stripped back and re connected and all is well, there was a blockage in some vent that the water should have been able to flow away from, leaves being the culprit,

mickdw · 24-03-2012 08:20PM

Can anyone explain why car ECUs are often fitted under windscreen scuttle panel where they are liable to be destroyed due to a simple blockage of a drain?

ofcork · 24-03-2012 08:25PM

AFAIK from reading the merc mag that water problem is very common with the 220 series as you said being blocked by leaves.

galwaytt · 24-03-2012 08:38PM

Owen wrote: »

Also, at first glance the solder joints looked fine, it was only under a magnifying glass that I could see the cracks, so reflow them all regardless if you think they're okay.

Lol, that takes me back......for years, MB looms were made, in part, in a factory in Waterford, and I used to deal with them on the subject of solder tips and soldering irons, as that was my area of knowledge....that any of the looms lasted escapes me, the soldering was poorly done, and they simply would not listen. They listened neither to me, to the iron manufacturer, nor the tip manufacturer. Thats what piece work gets you......

galwaytt · 24-03-2012 08:39PM

goat2 wrote: »

updating you all on this not starting problem, got to the end of it,
it was wiring that had gotten wet and had started to degrade at the connections, so it was stripped back and re connected and all is well, there was a blockage in some vent that the water should have been able to flow away from, leaves being the culprit,

Perceived quality at its finest.

You would never see an old LS400 do that.......

galwaytt · 24-03-2012 08:41PM

lomb wrote: »

Its obvious whoever sold it was because of that fault..
What would a 02 or 03 BMW 7 series be like? Seem like an amazing piece of kit for the money.

They have their electrical issues too.......very caveat, very emptor.....

goat2 · 24-03-2012 08:56PM

he is lucky that he went for second and third openion, one was about to put in a new starter next week, 800 euro, one was looking at this computer part the brains of the car, while the other started with wiring, he is very familiar with mercedes, and had seen this before with other mercs, and went for that vent and the wiring near it first and fair dues, he was right,
this thing was such a mystery, yet a fellow who knew the merc, went right for the mark, fantastic

25-03-2012 04:56AM

THe lad who was going to change the starter should be ashamed of his diagnostics skills, NissanDoc was on the right track with his first post in this thread

Pdfile · 25-03-2012 05:00AM

Eric Cartman wrote: »

The LS430 is a lovely car , but its not in the same leauge as the s class or 7 series , its just not as well equipped and doesnt have the same percieved luxury about it

but in fairness, the lexus is not only a better looker driver and more reliable... but people will let you out at junctions.

lomb · 25-03-2012 08:22AM

Great end glad its back on the road and not headed for junkyard.
Could you let us know the specialists details, I might pick up an S shortly, thanks

JP 1800 · 25-03-2012 10:21AM

I am only catching this now, the poorly designed drainage ducts are well documented for the W220 series and should have been checked. There is a technical bulletin which remedies this problem by basically cutting the ends off the duct to aid drainage and regularly during a service unblock the tube with a tool ( basically a rod with tape ). The W220 are a fine car which can be bought cheaply nowdays, the biggest concerns are obliviously electrical but also air suspension which can be expensive to fix. I have done a bit of work on the S class and on the CL class and they are an expensive car to maintain properly which is a problem when they reach a certain value.

320 s class mercedes not starting

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