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Rally Car Crashes into Spectators in Cavan- Two Dead Seven Injured

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Comments

  • #32
    questionmark?
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,082 ✭✭✭questionmark?


    Some ridiculous comments been made on this thread. Lets not forgot that people lost their lives today in an accident and others we presume are fighting for their lives or may have to cope with life changing injuries.


  • #33
    hondasam
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,418 ✭✭✭✭hondasam


    questionmark? wrote: »
    Some ridiculous comments been made on this thread. Lets not forgot that people lost their lives today in an accident and others we presume are fighting for their lives or may have to cope with life changing injuries.

    yes but you have to remember these people were there as spectators to watch a sport they liked.
    It's up to everyone to watch from a safe distance, I have been to lots of rallies myself and I know what it's like, everyone wants the best view.


  • #34
    mike65
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88,968 ✭✭✭✭mike65


    Not too mention the impact this will have on the driver and his navigator.

    There will always be a risk level and the safety standards are higher than they used to be - anyone remember Group B in the 80s?


  • #35
    Sky King
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,431 ✭✭✭Sky King


    I am not into rallying but I was channel surfing about a fortnight ago and watched it for 20 mins or so and one thing that I really noticed as I watched was how dangerous some of the spots the spectators were standing were... like on the outside of bends and stuff like that. I actually remember thinking at the time that it's amazing it doesn't happen regularly.

    Unfortunate accident though.


  • #36
    Doc Ruby
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,956 ✭✭✭Doc Ruby


    They really need to get on top of the spectator situation to be honest. How they do it I neither know nor care, but these won't be the last fatalities unless things get a bit tighter. You've a ton of metal doing 90 on sharp corners only meters from crowds, I'm surprised its lasted this long.


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  • #37
    My name is URL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,191 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    Race stewards are always telling people to move away from the spots that are deemed to be more dangerous. A lot of corners are cordoned off these days so people simply can't stand at them. It just wouldn't be feasible to man the entire route with officials or to keep it completely clear of spectators.. that may be possible in much larger events but not small amateur rally stages like this.

    This happened on a relatively straight stretch of road iinm. It was a tragic accident and couldn't have been foreseen.

    As for the people that stand on extremely tight and dangerous corners regardless of being aware of the risks and warned not to.. well, they're idiots.


  • #38
    Mint Sauce
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,293 ✭✭✭✭Mint Sauce


    Doc Ruby wrote: »
    They really need to get on top of the spectator situation to be honest. How they do it I neither know nor care, but these won't be the last fatalities unless things get a bit tighter. You've a ton of metal doing 90 on sharp corners only meters from crowds, I'm surprised its lasted this long.

    Apologies in advance, but based on that comment I'm assuming you dont really follow rallying. TBH I'm not really a huge fan my self but I do know there is many all over the Island throughout the year, four of which I can name in this region alone, this weekends Cavan Stages, the Donegal Rally, The Forestery Rally (something like that) also in Donegal, The lakes (Caven, Leitrim, and I think Fermanagh).

    I'm also guessing if it wasn't for todays unfortunate news, how many people who have called to changes to the sport on this thread would have even known it was taking place this weekend?

    Yes they weren't the first, and unfortunatly they probably wont be the last, its a very small unfortunate satistic, but then so is footballers dying on the pitch, if the same attitude was taken to that and other sports we would be calling for changes and bannings to many sports.

    These things a reviewed all the time, and this will also most definalty prompt another review, but lets not write the sport off all together.


  • #39
    Doc Ruby
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,956 ✭✭✭Doc Ruby


    irish-stew wrote: »
    I'm also guessing if it wasn't for todays unfortunate news, how many people who have called to changes to the sport on this thread would have even known it was taking place this weekend?
    We've plenty of experience with rallies where I come from, never fear.
    irish-stew wrote: »
    Yes they weren't the first, and they wont be the last, its a very small unfortunate satistic, but then so is footballers dying on the pitch, if the same attitude was taken to that and other sports we would be calling for changes and bannings to many sports.
    All I'm saying is, when people start dying, things start changing. Its up to the sport to survive with those changes or not. Its not even an argument, this is almost certainly how its going to go. Rallying is a cool sport, I for one stand beside any who want to see machines go faster, but the spectator safety issue needs to be definitively handled.


  • #40
    hairyprincess
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,299 ✭✭✭hairyprincess


    Ares wrote: »
    Lol! Those rallies. As in there are certain types of rallies that are ok but you detest the one held in Cavan today.

    Its a tragedy that people died following something they liked/loved. RIP to the two dead and I hope their families and other hurt involved get the support they need.

    How and ever motorsport is inherently dangerous and these people knew they were taking risks standing where they did. Sad and all as it is this shouldn't be a template for the banning of motorsport. If its banned then surely everything, with any risk of injury whatsoever no matter how minute the risk is, should also be banned with it.

    'Those rallies', as in rallies in general. I think you knew exactly what I meant.

    I detest rallies and always have done. Individual people and groups have fought to get speed limits reduced. There are constant advertisements encouraging people to slow down. And then we have this legalized race, which fine has professional drivers taking part, but it is encouraging 'boy racers' thinking they are the next best thing. And people standing inches away from cars speeding.

    There is no sense to it. It is not a sport. And I would 100% back a campaign to ban it. I have always held that opinion, long before the events of today.
    hondasam wrote: »
    How do you mean a senseless waste ?

    A senseless waste of life of course. Do you think it wasn't a waste?


  • #41
    The Big Red Button
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,390 ✭✭✭The Big Red Button


    hairyprincess wrote: »
    I detest rallies and always have done. Individual people and groups have fought to get speed limits reduced. There are constant advertisements encouraging people to slow down. And then we have this legalized race, which fine has professional drivers taking part, but it is encouraging 'boy racers' thinking they are the next best thing. And people standing inches away from cars speeding.

    Certain drivers are always going to drive irresponsibly, in every country, whether rally driving is a pastime or not.

    I can pretty much guarantee you that you have never seen a rally car speeding or driving in any way that could be considered dangerous outside of a rally stage, as they would be very heavily penalised for this (and why on earth would they risk the damage to their car, anyways.)

    Is it not a good thing to be teaching people to keep speeding, etc, where it's appropriate and regulated? At any rally I've attended, there's been a massive emphasis on safety, and sure there are tonnes of Gardaí in the area at any rally, regularly breathalising and checking for insurance/tax/NCT etc. It's not a hang-out for "boy-racers", it's for motor enthusiasts, who care about their cars, and who aren't going to go risking their cars and their licences through "messing"!


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  • #42
    The Big Red Button
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,390 ✭✭✭The Big Red Button


    And for those suggesting that you can rock up to a rally and stand on the outside of a corner or at any old spot you want to - just try it, someday! At any rally I've attended, it's very well regulated, the most dangerous spots are cordoned off. And there are plenty of marshalls (or the race cannot go ahead.) While the marshalls (who work in a voluntary capacity) can warn you away from certain spots, they can't force you to move - and they will call off the stage, rather than leaving you standing in a very dangerous zone.

    However they can't have marshalls at every bit of the stage. For very obvious reasons. So, naturally, the discretion of the spectators is required.

    I've been talking to people who were at the rally today, and from what I've heard, it was a completely freak accident at a relatively "safe" part of the stage. It's just very sad. But there are risks involved in every sport, and rally participants and spectators accept those risks - there's only so much you can do to mitigate them.


  • #43
    questionmark?
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,082 ✭✭✭questionmark?


    questionmark? wrote: »
    Some ridiculous comments been made on this thread. Lets not forgot that people lost their lives today in an accident and others we presume are fighting for their lives or may have to cope with life changing injuries.
    hondasam wrote: »
    yes but you have to remember these people were there as spectators to watch a sport they liked.
    It's up to everyone to watch from a safe distance, I have been to lots of rallies myself and I know what it's like, everyone wants the best view.

    There was a reason I said some of the statements where ridiculous as two of the injured just so happen to be my cousins. (They try to stay safe as best they can and have been following rallies for years up and down the country) Hoping they pull through and my thoughts are with the famiies of those that have passed away :(


  • #44
    PogMoThoin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,874 ✭✭✭✭PogMoThoin


    hairyprincess wrote: »
    'Those rallies', as in rallies in general. I think you knew exactly what I meant.

    I detest rallies and always have done. Individual people and groups have fought to get speed limits reduced. There are constant advertisements encouraging people to slow down. And then we have this legalized race, which fine has professional drivers taking part, but it is encouraging 'boy racers' thinking they are the next best thing. And people standing inches away from cars speeding.

    There is no sense to it. It is not a sport. And I would 100% back a campaign to ban it. I have always held that opinion, long before the events of today.

    FFS. What a backward statement. Should we ban all motorsport? Formula 1 encourages the same, should we ban that?


  • #45
    hondasam
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,418 ✭✭✭✭hondasam


    questionmark? wrote: »
    There was a reason I said some of the statements where ridiculous as two of the injured just so happen to be my cousins. (They don't try to stay safe as best they can and have been following rallies for years up and down the country) Hoping they pull through and my thoughts are with the famiies of those that have passed away :(

    I'm sorry about your cousins and I hope they get better soon.
    I really don't understand your comment tbh.


  • #46
    Dyr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    irish-stew wrote: »
    RIP.

    This was a terrible freak accident, although I think its a bit early to be making generalisations about those who attend the events, or discussing the merits of the sport.

    :(

    Regardless of calls for bans and thinking of the childer, you can't call it a freak accident,a car travelling very fast indeed on a country road goes flying out of control? Hardly unforseeable is it?


  • #47
    hondasam
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,418 ✭✭✭✭hondasam


    Bambi wrote: »
    Regardless of calls for bans and thinking of the childer, you can't call it a freak accident,a car travelling very fast indeed on a country road goes flying out of control? Hardly unforseeable is it?

    How often does it happen ?


  • #48
    Monty Burnz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,455 ✭✭✭✭Monty Burnz


    hondasam wrote: »
    How often does it happen ?
    Indeed. How often are people killed falling off horses? BAN EVERYTHING!!


  • #49
    Temptamperu
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,303 ✭✭✭Temptamperu


    hondasam wrote: »
    How often does it happen ?

    It happened today. I know im pointing the obvious but there has to be a way to get tracks built with proper safety. I know its probably not the best solution but if these idiots want to pump money to watch things go fast, pay for and build a track.


  • #50
    wendell borton
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,336 ✭✭✭wendell borton


    If it was on a track it woudn't be a rally.


  • #51
    hondasam
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,418 ✭✭✭✭hondasam


    Temptamperu wrote: »
    It happened today. I know im pointing the obvious but there has to be a way to get tracks built with proper safety. I know its probably not the best solution but if these idiots want to pump money to watch things go fast, pay for and build a track.

    A track would not be the same thing at all.
    You calling the drivers or spectators idiots?


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  • #52
    Stark
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,154 ✭✭✭✭Stark


    Monty Burnz wrote: »
    Indeed. How often are people killed falling off horses? BAN EVERYTHING!!

    Well if people are going to say that rally driving encourages boy racers, you could say that horse riding encourages sulky racing. But it's an upper class sport, so it's okay.


  • #53
    Temptamperu
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,303 ✭✭✭Temptamperu


    hondasam wrote: »
    A track would not be the same thing at all.
    You calling the drivers or spectators idiots?

    Both really, there are better things to do of a Sunday than watch boy racer cars going fast. And I know it "wouldn't be the same" but it works fine in Japan.


  • #54
    hondasam
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,418 ✭✭✭✭hondasam


    Temptamperu wrote: »
    Both really, there are better things to do of a Sunday than watch boy racer cars going fast. And I know it "wouldn't be the same" but it works fine in Japan.

    Some people enjoy it, I would be a fan myself and would watch it when it's local.
    If your not into cars then it's boring.


  • #55
    girl in the striped socks
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 653 ✭✭✭girl in the striped socks


    Temptamperu wrote: »
    hondasam wrote: »
    A track would not be the same thing at all.
    You calling the drivers or spectators idiots?

    Both really, there are better things to do of a Sunday than watch boy racer cars going fast. And I know it "wouldn't be the same" but it works fine in Japan.
    Classy.
    Two dead & seven people injured & you call them idiots.
    Really classy.


  • #56
    Temptamperu
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,303 ✭✭✭Temptamperu


    hondasam wrote: »
    Some people enjoy it, I would be a fan myself and would watch it when it's local.
    If your not into cars then it's boring.

    "Some" people like weed but we cant have it because its "too dangerous"
    Im not saying ban it or get rid, just make tracks whats the problem you could simulate a country road quite easily.


  • #57
    Temptamperu
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,303 ✭✭✭Temptamperu


    girl in the striped socks wrote: »
    Classy.
    Two dead & seven people injured & you call them idiots.
    Really classy.

    now that's not the point i'm making i was horrified when i heard it on the radio. I just think it should be off the roads and on a track.

    Obviously me heart goes out to the victims.


  • #58
    planetX
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,441 ✭✭✭planetX


    chatterpillar wrote: »
    Certain drivers are always going to drive irresponsibly, in every country, whether rally driving is a pastime or not.

    I can pretty much guarantee you that you have never seen a rally car speeding or driving in any way that could be considered dangerous outside of a rally stage, as they would be very heavily penalised for this (and why on earth would they risk the damage to their car, anyways.)

    Is it not a good thing to be teaching people to keep speeding, etc, where it's appropriate and regulated? At any rally I've attended, there's been a massive emphasis on safety, and sure there are tonnes of Gardaí in the area at any rally, regularly breathalising and checking for insurance/tax/NCT etc. It's not a hang-out for "boy-racers", it's for motor enthusiasts, who care about their cars, and who aren't going to go risking their cars and their licences through "messing"!

    you may not see a rally car speeding outside of the race - but you most certainly get rally followers speeding around the lanes like lunatics in the middle of the night, and it goes on for many nights afterwards.
    What other sport is allowed to take over a public road, sending letters telling you that you must not attempt to walk or cycle anywhere - that if you need an ambulance you have to contact a marshall. And then putting tape across your driveway and tying your gates shut. I'd like to see it stopped, or at the very least moved - maybe you lot could campaign to host it on your road instead of mine, thanks.


  • #59
    The Big Red Button
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,390 ✭✭✭The Big Red Button


    planetX wrote: »
    sending letters telling you that you must not attempt to walk or cycle anywhere - that if you need an ambulance you have to contact a marshall. And then putting tape across your driveway and tying your gates shut.

    All of those things are very clearly in your own best interests, in an attempt to minimise any inconvenience to you!


  • #60
    Ares
    Site Banned Posts: 549 ✭✭✭Ares


    hairyprincess wrote: »
    I detest rallies and always have done. Individual people and groups have fought to get speed limits reduced.

    You're off to a bad start I'm afraid, to use a motoring analogy. In Ireland the general speed limit has been reduced once, in 1979 as a response to the 1979 energy crisis not due to any road safety measures of lobbying from road safety groups. It was reduced by 5 mph only to be restored to its previous limit of 60mph in 92. In fact current speed limit has never been higher. Thus these indivual people and groups have a rather miserable battle to get speed limits reduced it seems.
    hairyprincess wrote: »
    There are constant advertisements encouraging people to slow down. And then we have this legalized race, which fine has professional drivers taking part, but it is encouraging 'boy racers' thinking they are the next best thing. And people standing inches away from cars speeding.

    Indeed there are such advertisements. However what does normal every day driving have to with driving a closed off section of road to test speed.

    Oh, and of the rally heads I know, the hate 'boy racers'. Hate them. 'Boy racers' as a breed are dying off as well, one of the positive benefits of the recession. Most of them are/were too stupid to hold down a proper job and have thus been forced to emigrate. Thank fúck.

    And even so the fact that rallying encourages 'boy racers' is the main synopsis of your argument is quite laughable.

    One other thing. They're not 'speeding.' 'Speeding' implies that one is exceeding the speed limit of the road. Since the road is specifically closed off and a race without speed limits is legally sanctioned, no speed laws are being broke and participants are not in fact 'speeding.'
    hairyprincess wrote: »
    There is no sense to it. It is not a sport. And I would 100% back a campaign to ban it. I have always held that opinion, long before the events of today.

    It kind of is. The clue is in the name really. Motorsport. :rolleyes:

    And also, I presume you would also 100% back a ban on single seater racing as well.

    Which is interesting as pretty much every safety measure introduced into your basic modern car has trickled down from elite motorsport. The very thing you which to ban to increase safety I presume. #Ironic.


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  • #61
    girl in the striped socks
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 653 ✭✭✭girl in the striped socks


    Temptamperu wrote: »
    girl in the striped socks wrote: »
    Classy.
    Two dead & seven people injured & you call them idiots.
    Really classy.

    now that's not the point i'm making i was horrified when i heard it on the radio. I just think it should be off the roads and on a track.

    Obviously me heart goes out to the victims.
    Oh my mistake. It's just when you posted "idiots" & then confirmed that you meant both the participants & spectators I wrongly assumed that was the point you were trying to make.
    Rallying is an expensive sport, it can cost quite a lot of money even with a mickey mouse car. I could be wrong but if the option of recreating a track to mimic country roads was viable it probably would have been done by now.


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