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Teenage girl dies on street from peanut allergy

  • 20-12-2013 10:56AM
    #1
    Gyalist
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,537 ✭✭✭Gyalist


    Emma (14) was out for a pre-Christmas meal with her family when she accidentally ate a nut-based sauce and suffered a severe allergic reaction

    But when her mother rushed to a nearby pharmacy to get help, she was refused a life-saving adrenaline injection because she didn't have a prescription.

    The distraught mother was told to bring her daughter to hospital but the two had only got a few yards away when the teenager collapsed.

    Emma's mother, Caroline, told the Irish Independent: "I'm so angry I was not given the epipen to inject her. I was told to bring Emma to an A&E department.

    LINK

    RIP Emma, and my heartfelt condolences to her family and friends.

    This story has me really shaken as my teenaged son has a severe nut allergy and this is the stuff of my worst nightmares.


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Comments

  • #2
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,611 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    If that's accurate about the pharmacy not giving out the shot, well, yeah, not much can be said about it. I'll await the usual by-the-bookers to come along though.


  • #3
    osarusan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,794 ✭✭✭✭osarusan


    Horrible story. The stuff of nightmares.

    Why didn't the mother/parents have the necessary medication themselves though?

    I'd have thought that for allergies like these, carrying the medicine around for an emergency would have been acceptable to doctors, surely.


  • #4
    Dave0301
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,673 ✭✭✭Dave0301


    Pharmacy should have given the epipen, the girl should have had an epipen with her as well tho.


  • #5
    shruikan2553
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,113 ✭✭✭shruikan2553


    Terrible thing to happen but if you have an allergy that can kill you you should always have the medication with you and ask before ordering anything.


  • #6
    biko
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 81,219 ✭✭✭✭biko


    Unfortunately chemists can't give out drugs like that. Maybe this will bring out some emergency legislation but it's too late for Emma now.

    Poor parents :(


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  • #7
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,611 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    osarusan wrote: »
    Horrible story. The stuff of nightmares.

    Why didn't the mother/parents have the necessary medication themselves though?

    I'd have thought that for allergies like these, carrying the medicine around for an emergency would have been acceptable to doctors, surely.
    They could've left it at home. Things like these will happen eventually, if you think of someone who leaves the house twice a day to go somewhere, and not including along the way, that's 4 opportunities a day to forget to carry something, about 1500 per year. Once in a while the worst will happen to someone and it will coincide with not having their device.


  • #8
    Plazaman
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,015 ✭✭✭Plazaman


    Prescription needed pharmacy assistant should be brought to task on this. An obvious emergency overrides all bureaucracy.


  • #9
    Gyalist
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,537 ✭✭✭Gyalist


    Deleted User wrote: »
    If that's accurate about the pharmacy not giving out the shot, well, yeah, not much can be said about it. I'll await the usual by-the-bookers to come along though.

    My son is supposed to carry his Anapen with him at all times but sometimes doesn't. The reported reaction by the pharmacy doesn't surprise me though as I've come across many medical people who are uninformed about anaphylactic shock and how quickly it can become fatal.


  • #10
    The Pheasant2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,699 ✭✭✭The Pheasant2


    I understand the need for all the restrictions etc. when giving out drugs but if my daughter was about to die I think I'd be vaulting over the counter and taking the adrenaline myself


  • #11
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 3,505 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I don't want to sound cold - obviously this is a tragic event for her family and friends.

    But I think it's beyond unfair to blame the pharmacy. The family, including Emma, knew that she had a severe peanut allergy. She chose something with peanuts in it, and no one had her epipen with them. Those are the two oversights that lead to her reaction. It's a more than understandable mistake to make, but it's not up to the pharmacy to hand out serious medication like that to people that come in off the street with no prescription. I can understand her mother feeling distraught about it, but I think it's irresponsible for the Independent to publish what reads a lot like an accusation against the pharmacy.


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  • #12
    SEPT 23 1989
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,039 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    I would have gone in over the counter and faced the consequences later

    This will be a living nightmare for the mother RIP


  • #13
    osarusan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,794 ✭✭✭✭osarusan


    Deleted User wrote: »
    They could've left it at home. Things like these will happen eventually, if you think of someone who leaves the house twice a day to go somewhere, and not including along the way, that's 4 opportunities a day to forget to carry something, about 1500 per year. Once in a while the worst will happen to someone and it will coincide with not having their device.
    My father was stung by a whole loads of bees one time, and nearly died. As a result, for a few year after, even one sting could have killed him, so he carried some 'antidote' pills round his neck at all times. I appreciate that this is much easier than carrying a syringe though.

    From the pharmacy's perspective, say they give the injection 5 times - the first 4, they save somebody's life, and get a deserved pat on the back. The 5th turns out not to be the allergic reaction everybody thought it was, rather a different condition, and the injection kills them. The pharmacy is probably facing a massive massive lawsuit.

    i can't help but think though, that if my family (including my child with this allergy) was going out for dinner rather than eating food cooked at home, I'd be bringing the medicine with me, and moreover, not letting anybody at the table order anything with nuts in it (it says she ate it by mistake, so not sure how it ended up at the table).


  • #14
    Turtwig
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,578 ✭✭✭✭Turtwig


    Plazaman wrote: »
    Prescription needed pharmacy assistant should be brought to task on this. An obvious emergency overrides all bureaucracy.

    That's the problem though the obvious emergency isn't obvious enough to some. I highly doubt if the pharmacy thought she was going to die they'd have refused it. This smacks more of naivety than strict adherence to bureaucracy.


  • #15
    camel jockey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 909 ✭✭✭camel jockey


    This is a very unfortunate story. Unfortunately I think the mother, in her grief, is not looking at this clearly, which is to be expected.

    3 things went wrong, she is focusing on the one that was out of her or the daughters control.

    Sympathy to all concerned, including the staff member at the pharmacy.


  • #16
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    osarusan wrote: »
    Why didn't the mother/parents have the necessary medication themselves though?

    They did have some. Unfortunately, it had been left behind somewhere else though.
    Plazaman wrote: »
    Prescription needed pharmacy assistant should be brought to task on this. An obvious emergency overrides all bureaucracy.

    A pharmacist, or even more likely a pharmaceutical technician are not in a position to judge an emergency situation.
    true-or-false wrote: »
    I don't want to sound cold - obviously this is a tragic event for her family and friends.

    But I think it's beyond unfair to blame the pharmacy. The family, including Emma, knew that she had a severe peanut allergy. She chose something with peanuts in it, and no one had her epipen with them. Those are the two oversights that lead to her reaction. It's a more than understandable mistake to make, but it's not up to the pharmacy to hand out serious medication like that to people that come in off the street with no prescription. I can understand her mother feeling distraught about it, but I think it's irresponsible for the Independent to publish what reads a lot like an accusation against the pharmacy.

    I don't think it reads like that. It is just relaying the facts and the devastation that this poor girls mother is going through.

    However, I would have expected that the pharmacy kept them in, while awaiting an ambulance, which could have gotten to them quicker, than running to a hospital, while the girl was in no condition to do so.


  • #17
    Ginny
    Hosted Moderators Posts: 13,425 ✭✭✭✭Ginny


    Knowing the pharmacy in question I can understand how it happened, that pharmacy/staff have a terrible time on O'Connell St. That pharmacist that helped me when I was pregnant and prescribed discontinued drugs and I needed them urgently. He rang around all the other local pharmacies to see who had any in stock so I didn't have to go looking at 37 weeks, while the hospital and other pharmacies just said they didn't have them and sent me on my way. Sadly his hands were tied, I understand how he could have assessed the situation better, but after spending some time in that pharmacy they are besieged with addicts robbing the place left right and centre and chancing their arm, it's a pharmacy that usually has to have a security guard, which is necessary and ridiculous!


  • #18
    Aestivalis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 202 ✭✭Aestivalis


    Instead of running to a pharmacy and then contemplating running to the A&E, the mother should have phoned 999 immediately.
    Ambulance would have been there with an epi-pen sooner.

    Pharmacists cant give out such medications like that. Adrenaline is a dangerous drug if used incorrectly, and as mentioned above, pharmacists arent in a position to be paramedics.


  • #19
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,611 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Ginny wrote: »
    Knowing the pharmacy in question I can understand how it happened, that pharmacy/staff have a terrible time on O'Connell St. That pharmacist that helped me when I was pregnant and prescribed discontinued drugs and I needed them urgently. He rang around all the other local pharmacies to see who had any in stock so I didn't have to go looking at 37 weeks, while the hospital and other pharmacies just said they didn't have them and sent me on my way. Sadly his hands were tied, I understand how he could have assessed the situation better, but after spending some time in that pharmacy they are besieged with addicts robbing the place left right and centre and chancing their arm, it's a pharmacy that usually has to have a security guard, which is necessary and ridiculous!
    Walking past that pharmacy fairly regularly makes me think it's funny how by-the-book they were in this particular case.


  • #20
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,611 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Aestivalis wrote: »
    Instead of running to a pharmacy and then contemplating running to the A&E, the mother should have phoned 999 immediately.
    Ambulance would have been there with an epi-pen sooner..
    Taxi would be quicker than an ambulance.


  • #21
    Riskymove
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,900 ✭✭✭✭Riskymove


    osarusan wrote: »
    From the pharmacy's perspective, say they give the injection 5 times - the first 4, they save somebody's life, and get a deserved pat on the back. The 5th turns out not to be the allergic reaction everybody thought it was, rather a different condition, and the injection kills them. The pharmacy is probably facing a massive massive lawsuit.

    unfortunatekly this is probably a big factor

    at the same time I think I'd be pretty sympatheitic to them....I am sure they are very traumatised too as to what subsequently happened

    i can't help but think though, that if my family (including my child with this allergy) was going out for dinner rather than eating food cooked at home, I'd be bringing the medicine with me, and moreover, not letting anybody at the table order anything with nuts in it (it says she ate it by mistake, so not sure how it ended up at the table).

    hindsight is everything and I think many people will get a rather tragic reminder about bringing these things with them as a result of this

    on the radio this morning the suggestion was she simply poured a different sauce (satay) than what she though she was (curry) pouring....as simple a mistake as that


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  • #22
    danniemcq
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,163 ✭✭✭✭danniemcq


    Deleted User wrote: »
    If that's accurate about the pharmacy not giving out the shot, well, yeah, not much can be said about it. I'll await the usual by-the-bookers to come along though.

    at work i had to write a letter to the first aid people to allow them to stab me with my pen in the leg.

    its stupid how people are afraid of getting sued or whatever if they do something without permission.

    It makes me sick to my stomach thinking about this.


  • #23
    camel jockey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 909 ✭✭✭camel jockey


    DannieHasAFanny wrote: »
    its stupid how people are afraid of getting sued or whatever if they do something without permission.

    :rolleyes:


  • #24
    Aestivalis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 202 ✭✭Aestivalis


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Taxi would be quicker than an ambulance.

    In Dublin on a wednesday evening, it would fair out a lot better than the rest of the country.
    Plus, ambulances have trained paramedics with medication and equipment to deal with it. Rather than bundling somebody into a taxi and hoping for the best as you drag them into the a&e reception 15 mins later.


  • #25
    Riskymove
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,900 ✭✭✭✭Riskymove


    DannieHasAFanny wrote: »
    at work i had to write a letter to the first aid people to allow them to stab me with my pen in the leg.

    its stupid how people are afraid of getting sued or whatever if they do something without permission.

    It makes me sick to my stomach thinking about this.

    unfortunately thats Ireland for you...its not really the first aid people's faulkt but the people who would sue someone for trying to help them

    we need a Good Samaritan law for it to be any other way


  • #26
    danniemcq
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,163 ✭✭✭✭danniemcq


    osarusan wrote: »
    From the pharmacy's perspective, say they give the injection 5 times - the first 4, they save somebody's life, and get a deserved pat on the back. The 5th turns out not to be the allergic reaction everybody thought it was, rather a different condition, and the injection kills them. The pharmacy is probably facing a massive massive lawsuit.

    Doesn't work that way, if the shot kills you then you would have died a long time ago.

    When i was first diagnosed as hyper something or other sensitive to nuts (the smell makes me sick) I asked the doc what would happen if i thought i was having an attack and took it but i wasn't actually having an attack.

    Nothing happens bar you get an adrenaline rush. The same natural reaction that happens when you get scared or go on a roller coaster or have to run away from the guards.

    All it is is a more concentrated dose being injected into muscles. You won't die from the shot as your own body would have killed you long long ago


  • #27
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 50,630 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    DannieHasAFanny wrote: »
    at work i had to write a letter to the first aid people to allow them to stab me with my pen in the leg.

    its stupid how people are afraid of getting sued or whatever if they do something without permission.

    It makes me sick to my stomach thinking about this.

    I thought of you immediately this morning when I heard this news :(
    camel jockey wrote: »
    :rolleyes:

    Awesome contribution there.


  • #28
    danniemcq
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,163 ✭✭✭✭danniemcq


    Riskymove wrote: »
    unfortunately thats Ireland for you...its not really the first aid people's faulkt but the people who would sue someone for trying to help them

    we need a Good Samaritan law for it to be any other way

    we do have a good Samaritan law, thats the thing

    http://www.thejournal.ie/new-civil-law-bill-might-just-make-us-nicer-people-163046-Jun2011/

    http://www.imt.ie/opinion/2012/02/new-protection-for-volunteers-and-good-samaritans.html


  • #29
    camel jockey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 909 ✭✭✭camel jockey


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I thought of you immediately this morning when I heard this news :(



    Awesome contribution there.

    Thanks. The comment I quoted was so stupid I couldn't think of anything to say, so I let the smilie do the talking.


  • #30
    shruikan2553
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,113 ✭✭✭shruikan2553


    Riskymove wrote: »
    unfortunately thats Ireland for you...its not really the first aid people's faulkt but the people who would sue someone for trying to help them

    we need a Good Samaritan law for it to be any other way

    As far as I know we do. Was told as long as we were trying to help someone using a method we are trained in then we cannot be sued.


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  • #31
    camel jockey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 909 ✭✭✭camel jockey


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I thought of you immediately this morning when I heard this news :(

    Equally awesome !!! Well done.


This discussion has been closed.
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