Sherlock or Elementary

Pessimist · 27-12-2013 4:17am #1

Sorry if this has been posted before.

Just wondering what other viewers thoughts are on Elementary?

I love the series 'Sherlock' so when my dad said he preferred 'Elementary', I was very skeptical. However, now after watching both, I tend to agree! Anyone else into both series?

meoklmrk91 · 27-12-2013 4:25am

I like both, personally prefer Sherlock as its innovative and different but elementary deserves quite the honerable mention, Jonny Lee Miller is a fantastic Sherlock and Lucy Lui is great too.

I think both shows have their great points, Elemetary is very good for a network show and shouldn't be looked down upon, but like I said Sherlock wins it for me.

jenjenten · 27-12-2013 4:47am

meoklmrk91 wrote: »

I like both, personally prefer Sherlock as its innovative and different but elementary deserves quite the honerable mention, Jonny Lee Miller is a fantastic Sherlock and Lucy Lui is great too.

I think both shows have their great points, Elemetary is very good for a network show and shouldn't be looked down upon, but like I said Sherlock wins it for me.

Agreed...they are quite different shows, Elementary is rather a US procedural at its core....but Jonny Lee Miller is superb as Sherlock, Emmy stuff.

As i said before the deduction style is nothing like the BBC show and the case-of-the-week are rather predictable, but when the show gets into "Sherlock" mode or season arc story its brilliant.

Quality and writing wise its a clear win for Sherlock, but Elementary has two strong leads, Holmes-ian nods aplenty and in terms of a proceadural its high quality as CBS is known for its the genre.

pickarooney · 27-12-2013 11:48am

Sherlock at its best is miles better than Elementary, but at its worst it's barely watchable.

ixoy · 27-12-2013 4:45pm

pickarooney got it right there - I find Sherlock varies a lot more in quality. It's more inventive but can suffer as a result.

Elementary - you know what you're getting roughly with a procedural and this is a fairly high quality, a large part due to some excellent casting choices. Mr. Miller is perfect in the role and his wiry, on edge performance nicely differentiates him from Cumberbatch's more focused one (equally excellent). I think Lucy Liu, after some initial concerns, is actually a good side kick and Aidan Quinn's role in it is, for me, a better balance than Sherlock's Lestrade (he's basically the New York role of Lestrade although Lestrade himself is a separate character in Elementary).

Watch both!

Dravokivich · 27-12-2013 9:57pm

I prefer how holmes as a character is presented in elementary. Tried watching sherlock and just dont like it. Equally theres things I dont like about elementary.

Achtung Maybe · 27-12-2013 10:07pm

I like the intensity of Sherlock and think he (Cumberbatch ) is the closest to the quintessential Holmes (Basil Rathbone IMHO ). However Elementary has grown on me with excellent storytelling coupled with a worthy supporting cast.

Both excellent for very different reasons and equally watchable in my eyes

astrofool · 28-12-2013 4:24pm

Just making my way through Sherlock right now, I thought it would be better (still good mind), Moffat's style doesn't lend itself here as easily as it does Dr. Who, what real frustrated person leaves a card in a machine to go and get cash. Also can't mind Holmes reading Breitling quarterly, mysteries have been fairly obvious too.

jenjenten · 28-12-2013 4:34pm

Achtung Maybe wrote: »

I like the intensity of Sherlock and think he (Cumberbatch ) is the closest to the quintessential Holmes (Basil Rathbone IMHO ). However Elementary has grown on me with excellent storytelling coupled with a worthy supporting cast.

Both excellent for very different reasons and equally watchable in my eyes

They have humanised Sherlock much more then the BBC version, its like they are trying a multi season arc of making Sherlock more normal....the Elementary charcter is certainly more asbpergers and autistic then the very controlled Sherlock we see on the BBC.

Lots of body ticks and the like, the deducation style is easier to follow...probably dumbed down for an American audience.....no criticising the show but it has been Americanised.

ncmc · 29-12-2013 6:38pm

ixoy wrote: »

Aidan Quinn's role in it is, for me, a better balance than Sherlock's Lestrade (he's basically the New York role of Lestrade although Lestrade himself is a separate character in Elementary)

In the books, there was a second police inspector, Gregson, so Elementary went with him as the main police officer and had Lestrade as a one off character when they travelled to London.

I agree with the consensus to watch both. I think Sherlock edges Elementary with the quality of writing and acting. I think Cumberbatch is nothing short of superb and I personally prefer Freeman's Watson. That said, Lee Miller is excellent and I agree that Aidan Quinn is a better police chief. Elementary has the advantage of having more episodes so you can get more of a back story and explore the Watson/Holmes relationship more (although that can be a bit americanised at times)

I think they are different enough that you can watch both and not feel repetitive. I enjoy both but definitely feel Sherlock is the higher quality TV. In fact when Sherlock is at its best, I consider it some of the finest TV out there.

FunLover18 · 30-12-2013 12:08am

Sherlock is far superior as a whole however for me Lee Miller is a much better Holmes.

jenjenten · 30-12-2013 2:56am

FunLover18 wrote: »

Sherlock is far superior as a whole however for me Lee Miller is a much better Holmes.

i wouldnt say jonny lee is better, just a differently delivery and style.....thats the thing with sherlock holmes, its always interesting to see a new interpretation of the character and what each actor can bring.

jonny lee miller is emmy worthy though....i certainly hope he gets a gong at some stage.

FunLover18 · 30-12-2013 1:48pm

jenjenten wrote: »

i wouldnt say jonny lee is better, just a differently delivery and style.....thats the thing with sherlock holmes, its always interesting to see a new interpretation of the character and what each actor can bring.

jonny lee miller is emmy worthy though....i certainly hope he gets a gong at some stage.

I really don't like Cumberbatch's interpretation

ziggyman17 · 30-12-2013 7:23pm

Achtung Maybe wrote: »

I like the intensity of Sherlock and think he (Cumberbatch ) is the closest to the quintessential Holmes (Basil Rathbone IMHO ). However Elementary has grown on me with excellent storytelling coupled with a worthy supporting cast.

Both excellent for very different reasons and equally watchable in my eyes

Jeremy Brett for me is the perfect Holmes....

FloatingVoter · 30-12-2013 11:46pm

ziggyman17 wrote: »

Jeremy Brett for me is the perfect Holmes....

Ditto, I used to watch the old BW Basil Rathbone ones as a kid. Repeats on TV mind you, I'm not that old. So he was my first Sherlock. But Jeremy Brett became the part. He actually started to believe he was Sherlock Daniel Day Lewis style.

CSteven88 · 01-01-2014 6:10pm

Jonny Lee Miller plays the part superbly but hats off to Benedict Cumberbatch in Sherlock. One of the best for me just behind Jeremy Brett.

Frank Lee Midere · 11-01-2014 3:50pm

I've seen one elementary, so it might grow on me, but I dislike the Holmes character. Holmes isn't autistic nor have asbergers nor a tick in the books, he is a high functioning moral sociopath if even that ( a man of science I would say). I don't like the americanisation either. cumberbatch is much more in the mode of the books.

lertsnim · 11-01-2014 4:02pm

Started watching Sherlock this week and it is absolutely amazing. Not so sold on Elementary

FunLover18 · 11-01-2014 4:12pm

Frank Lee Midere wrote: »

I've seen one elementary, so it might grow on me, but I dislike the Holmes character. Holmes isn't autistic nor have asbergers nor a tick in the books, he is a high functioning moral sociopath if even that ( a man of science I would say). I don't like the americanisation either. cumberbatch is much more in the mode of the books.

Were autism and asbergers known about at the time Conan Doyle wrote the stories?

Of late Cumberbatch'd Holmes has turned into Sheldon Cooper with deductive powers. For me neither is how I imagine Holmes but JLM is my favourite, I think what I like about him is his sense of morals. In the books Holmes always has very strong morals and views on what is right and wrong, and I love that Elementary focuses on this, as most adaptations (Sherlock included) prefer to focus primarily on his superior intelligence.

FloatingVoter · 11-01-2014 4:13pm

Frank Lee Midere wrote: »

I've seen one elementary, so it might grow on me, but I dislike the Holmes character. Holmes isn't autistic nor have asbergers nor a tick in the books, he is a high functioning moral sociopath if even that ( a man of science I would say). I don't like the americanisation either. cumberbatch is much more in the mode of the books.

Yes, but the drug problem is authentic to the books. Both versions pick and mix from the originals and add twists of their own. As for Elementary Holmes being autistic / asbergers ? Yeah, the guy files his books alphabetically and from deep to daft but he also carries out semi-controlled explosions in his kitchen. I remember Mrs Hudson having similar problems with Jeremy Brett.
Like others have said - watch both...they're not trying to compete on any level. Sherlock is three movies every couple of years. Elementary is a 20 episode network show.

ceegee · 11-01-2014 4:29pm

I'd put elementary ahead of sherlock, it's big story arc episodes have been great so far, and the "crime of the week" episodes are always enjoyable at worst. My main issue with Sherlock is that for the first 2 seasons it offered 1 great episode, 1 good episode and 1 steaming turd. The low standard so far this year has seen the ratio of good to crap overall shift to 50/50 (blind banker, hounds and both episodes this year being the crap imo). No matter how good the high points, any show that is as much miss as hit deserves far more criticism than Sherlock receives, especially when you only get 3 episodes every year or so.

angeleyes · 11-01-2014 10:19pm

I like Elementary but my heart has to go with Sherlock.

Thankfully we will have more Sherlock to look forward to.

http://www.independent.ie/entertainment/tv-radio/sherlock-writers-plot-fourth-and-fifth-series-29903039.html

Monotype · 12-01-2014 11:19am

I'm quite fond of sherlock - or season 1 at least and was quite looking forward to season 3.
I think it might be a case of "Bíonn blas ar an mbeagán" - i.e., a little bit of something is nice, given that the seasons are so short and spaced out.

Elementary on the other hand, I'm finding a drag. Even the "good" episodes only just hold together enough real ideas. There's too little deduction or planning in the episodes, not enough big picture and clever writing (not talking about the season arcs, just in the episodes).
It's very much linear writing where one place is leading onto the the next and he makes awesome discoveries each time, mostly bull**** sort of stuff, which pales in comparison to stories of earlier midsomer murders or Jonathan Creek.
That said, I'm still following it a long, just to see if it can pick up and develop. It has gotten a little better, but the curve is very slow and they need to churn out more good episodes one after another.

So, in the end, which wins? Sherlock. I could recommend that to people. I couldn't really recommend elementary as worthwhile.

jenjenten · 12-01-2014 1:50pm

Monotype wrote: »

I'm quite fond of sherlock - or season 1 at least and was quite looking forward to season 3.
I think it might be a case of "Bíonn blas ar an mbeagán" - i.e., a little bit of something is nice, given that the seasons are so short and spaced out.

Elementary on the other hand, I'm finding a drag. Even the "good" episodes only just hold together enough real ideas. There's too little deduction or planning in the episodes, not enough big picture and clever writing (not talking about the season arcs, just in the episodes).
It's very much linear writing where one place is leading onto the the next and he makes awesome discoveries each time, mostly bull**** sort of stuff, which pales in comparison to stories of earlier midsomer murders or Jonathan Creek.
That said, I'm still following it a long, just to see if it can pick up and develop. It has gotten a little better, but the curve is very slow and they need to churn out more good episodes one after another.

So, in the end, which wins? Sherlock. I could recommend that to people. I couldn't really recommend elementary as worthwhile.

^ +1 about deduction style....its interesting to note the first say 8 episodes of season 1 were much better written, they were more complex....had genuine twists you didnt see coming. Even the deduction style was more enjoyable.

But then it stopped, i can only assume they ran out of ideas or more likely network interference to dumb things down. Those keynote episodes with Moriarty prove they can write deeply intricate plots.

But as you say most episode lead from A to B and its all very predictable and Holmes expkains it all in bite size for the US audience.

Sad really, such talent available.

Monotype · 12-01-2014 3:38pm

Yeah, it's just that I feel everything is A to B to C to D to E with Elementary.
I like when you can look back from D and say B makes more sense now and then at E, all the parts were there at A, we were just looking at them wrong. I really felt Sherlock did that in Season 1. They're still trying to do it and I'm kind of mixed over the new episodes. They're entertaining alright, but not the same Sherlockiness.

I've only seen it in a handful of Elementary episodes where you really go "Ah, wow"; where (a) it's not just made up as we go along and (b) it's a good twist or mystery.
Too many episodes in the series, I think, and the writers don't know what to do with themselves.

Callanutd · 13-01-2014 11:56am

Up until the latest seasons I would have been firmly Sherlock. Now not so much. The latest season of Sherlock is extremely disappointing. Episode 2 particularly but Ep. 1 isnt far behind and I hated the ending of 3.
Elementary on the other hand just gets stronger and stronger. Natalie Dormer is excellent as Moriarty and really plays Sherlocks nemesis/kryptonite much better than Andrew Scott's version.

RiverSong29 · 21-02-2014 9:35pm

I would have to say I would pick Sherlock because I love Benedict Cumberbatch's modern day interpretation of Sherlock. Jonny Lee Miller and Benedict were roomates at one time. 2 Sherlocks under one roof. :-)

irishcsifan · 21-02-2014 11:07pm

I like both equally as the shows are portrayed differently. Both actors are not bad looking either.

Sherlock or Elementary

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